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	<title>Comments on: Centaurs, Centaurs</title>
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	<description>Cosmic Confidential: A Future Investigation is the 2010 annual edition of Planet Waves.</description>
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		<title>By: Yeshe</title>
		<link>http://www.cosmicconfidential.com/astrology/centaurs-astrology-chiron-nessus.html/comment-page-1#comment-87</link>
		<dc:creator>Yeshe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Feb 2010 01:41:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cosmicconfidential.com/astrology/?p=484#comment-87</guid>
		<description>Thank you Eric for having the courage to start this conversation. I have been on an intense inner journey for this whole last year and your posts have both pushed me, inspired me and supported me in grappling with the whole sex thing. I left an 18 year relationship behind a year ago in which the sex was on and off, mostly off towards the end, celibate for 9 months and then recently ended a 4 month relationship where the sex was amazing but the rest wasn&#039;t cutting it. I am on fairly intense spiritual path as well. During my soul searching I have come to admit I really enjoy sex, have a healthy sexual appetite and find no reason it should not be a part of my life...BUT.....in our Judeo-Christian society of the walking wounded how does one find a partner secure and open enough to explore new definitions of relationship? explore the spiritual and healing aspects of sex? I am also finding in my daily encounters many people who are questioning their relationship parameters and redefining how they want to live their lives. Heterosexual monogamy just isn&#039;t cutting it anymore. Part of the reason I believe is that it asks one single person to play ALL of the roles. What if we split it up, e.g. one person is a great roommate, another is a great financial partner, another is a great mother (male or female) and another could be a great sexual partner? Just a thought.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you Eric for having the courage to start this conversation. I have been on an intense inner journey for this whole last year and your posts have both pushed me, inspired me and supported me in grappling with the whole sex thing. I left an 18 year relationship behind a year ago in which the sex was on and off, mostly off towards the end, celibate for 9 months and then recently ended a 4 month relationship where the sex was amazing but the rest wasn&#8217;t cutting it. I am on fairly intense spiritual path as well. During my soul searching I have come to admit I really enjoy sex, have a healthy sexual appetite and find no reason it should not be a part of my life&#8230;BUT&#8230;..in our Judeo-Christian society of the walking wounded how does one find a partner secure and open enough to explore new definitions of relationship? explore the spiritual and healing aspects of sex? I am also finding in my daily encounters many people who are questioning their relationship parameters and redefining how they want to live their lives. Heterosexual monogamy just isn&#8217;t cutting it anymore. Part of the reason I believe is that it asks one single person to play ALL of the roles. What if we split it up, e.g. one person is a great roommate, another is a great financial partner, another is a great mother (male or female) and another could be a great sexual partner? Just a thought.</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Francis</title>
		<link>http://www.cosmicconfidential.com/astrology/centaurs-astrology-chiron-nessus.html/comment-page-1#comment-85</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Francis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Feb 2010 23:26:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cosmicconfidential.com/astrology/?p=484#comment-85</guid>
		<description>Linda,

(( &quot;There was “free love” but it wasn’t really free; a lot of people paid an emotional price and the perhaps more damaging cost of having their ideals blown up.&quot; ))

Quoting myself there, I would not describe this as &quot;obstacle-free.&quot; To the contrary, I think that a lot of people got hurt and there were not sufficient tools to deal with the obstacles.

I won&#039;t venture into the teachings of HAI because to my knowledge it functions as a secret society; from everything I am told by its participants, there is a veil or vow of secrecy involved in the different levels. I have done &quot;tantra circuit&quot; to some degree as a teacher, and still do, and many people have said they see a similarity between my teachings and some of what HAI offers, with one exception being that I put all of my ideas out where they can be evaluated and commented on. 

I have not worked directly with Werner but my therapist in Seattle was one of his longtime henchmen, and so I have received many of the teachings. I relate some of them, as I do with many of the teachers who have influenced me, in my horoscopes and other writings. I am not sure the &quot;training&quot; route is the way to go at this point; it&#039;s not the route that I choose any more, though I think that retreats and intensives are a good idea, for those teachers who can withstand the energy of groups.

We are in a different time than any that our society has lived through, with many serious obstacles both inner and outer. I am suggesting that the safe and sane place is within, and then we can invite others to share with us in that space. I have only rarely found a place outside my own home/studio or the occasional space of a closer friend where I feel safe absolutely being myself. I continue to facilitate workshops when I am invited, I maintain my webspaces and hold space for the community that is forming around them, and continue to put out my ideas on a daily basis.

I can only speak for myself -- and I remain easily available, phone numbers published, reading my own email.

ef</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Linda,</p>
<p>(( &#8220;There was “free love” but it wasn’t really free; a lot of people paid an emotional price and the perhaps more damaging cost of having their ideals blown up.&#8221; ))</p>
<p>Quoting myself there, I would not describe this as &#8220;obstacle-free.&#8221; To the contrary, I think that a lot of people got hurt and there were not sufficient tools to deal with the obstacles.</p>
<p>I won&#8217;t venture into the teachings of HAI because to my knowledge it functions as a secret society; from everything I am told by its participants, there is a veil or vow of secrecy involved in the different levels. I have done &#8220;tantra circuit&#8221; to some degree as a teacher, and still do, and many people have said they see a similarity between my teachings and some of what HAI offers, with one exception being that I put all of my ideas out where they can be evaluated and commented on. </p>
<p>I have not worked directly with Werner but my therapist in Seattle was one of his longtime henchmen, and so I have received many of the teachings. I relate some of them, as I do with many of the teachers who have influenced me, in my horoscopes and other writings. I am not sure the &#8220;training&#8221; route is the way to go at this point; it&#8217;s not the route that I choose any more, though I think that retreats and intensives are a good idea, for those teachers who can withstand the energy of groups.</p>
<p>We are in a different time than any that our society has lived through, with many serious obstacles both inner and outer. I am suggesting that the safe and sane place is within, and then we can invite others to share with us in that space. I have only rarely found a place outside my own home/studio or the occasional space of a closer friend where I feel safe absolutely being myself. I continue to facilitate workshops when I am invited, I maintain my webspaces and hold space for the community that is forming around them, and continue to put out my ideas on a daily basis.</p>
<p>I can only speak for myself &#8212; and I remain easily available, phone numbers published, reading my own email.</p>
<p>ef</p>
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		<title>By: LindaGM</title>
		<link>http://www.cosmicconfidential.com/astrology/centaurs-astrology-chiron-nessus.html/comment-page-1#comment-79</link>
		<dc:creator>LindaGM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Feb 2010 01:54:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cosmicconfidential.com/astrology/?p=484#comment-79</guid>
		<description>Eric wrote...&quot;the relational element you describe is rudimentary; there’s no Pluto or Chiron in there. No discussion of psychic development, emotional exploration, and the sense of shifting identity that can only come through actual — and grounded — experience.

I’m suggesting we tune into precisely these things, and begin associating them with our sexuality instead of just the basically flat concepts of gratification and reproductive consequences. 

There’s a lot more going on in conscious sex than that. And there is one other level worth addressing. The tone of the sexual conversation of a society seems to set the tone for many other discussions...&quot;
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Thanks for taking the time to respond, Eric. I find your obstacle-free opinion about what it was like to awaken sexually during the 60&#039;s refreshing but inaccurate. 

When it comes to sexual awakening in any time or on any level (as you pointed out) the obstacles are perpetrated by the &#039;group&#039; or the structures of society composed of family, peers, medical establishments, religious circles and more recently - corporate marketing and their pursuit of the almighty dollar.

The issue is how to create space for oneself outside the noise to explore, reflect and design what one&#039;s personal preferences, depths, boundaries and affinities are. This is what was missing in the 60s. It was molten chaos. And many had their own agendas, shadows and issues and preyed on the naive and the young - who had no idea how to establish boundaries or integrate their experiences.

Help me out here - where do we go to learn of Eros in a safe, sane, and sacred environment? Where are the temples of love? Where are the teachers, the lightworkers, the sane?

There have been pioneers in raising awareness and creating a safe environment to explore. One in particular is Stan Dale, founder of the Human Awareness Institute. I&#039;ve never seen him mentioned in PW and yet the guy made a huge contribution to the uncovering of human intimacy, sexuality and spirituality and thousands of folks have done his workshops. (myself included) Werner Erhard also worked in this area - ever do est and its &#039;Danger Process&#039; or his 6 Day Course? Both of these seminars included intense group work on body image and simply &#039;being&#039; with another.

It all boils down to feeling safe. In birthing, in a relationship, in bed, in a group - doesn&#039;t matter what you WANT to get out of the situation, the overiding context is &#039;do I feel safe enough to let down my guard and explore beyond it?&#039;   And this is especially true when you get your gear off.

I have no conclusion to offer but appreciate this dialogue. It&#039;s quiet at the funeral home today and death and sex are very close. But that&#039;s a whole exploration in its own right.

Vulnerably from rainy Sydney,

Linda</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Eric wrote&#8230;&#8221;the relational element you describe is rudimentary; there’s no Pluto or Chiron in there. No discussion of psychic development, emotional exploration, and the sense of shifting identity that can only come through actual — and grounded — experience.</p>
<p>I’m suggesting we tune into precisely these things, and begin associating them with our sexuality instead of just the basically flat concepts of gratification and reproductive consequences. </p>
<p>There’s a lot more going on in conscious sex than that. And there is one other level worth addressing. The tone of the sexual conversation of a society seems to set the tone for many other discussions&#8230;&#8221;<br />
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^</p>
<p>Thanks for taking the time to respond, Eric. I find your obstacle-free opinion about what it was like to awaken sexually during the 60&#8242;s refreshing but inaccurate. </p>
<p>When it comes to sexual awakening in any time or on any level (as you pointed out) the obstacles are perpetrated by the &#8216;group&#8217; or the structures of society composed of family, peers, medical establishments, religious circles and more recently &#8211; corporate marketing and their pursuit of the almighty dollar.</p>
<p>The issue is how to create space for oneself outside the noise to explore, reflect and design what one&#8217;s personal preferences, depths, boundaries and affinities are. This is what was missing in the 60s. It was molten chaos. And many had their own agendas, shadows and issues and preyed on the naive and the young &#8211; who had no idea how to establish boundaries or integrate their experiences.</p>
<p>Help me out here &#8211; where do we go to learn of Eros in a safe, sane, and sacred environment? Where are the temples of love? Where are the teachers, the lightworkers, the sane?</p>
<p>There have been pioneers in raising awareness and creating a safe environment to explore. One in particular is Stan Dale, founder of the Human Awareness Institute. I&#8217;ve never seen him mentioned in PW and yet the guy made a huge contribution to the uncovering of human intimacy, sexuality and spirituality and thousands of folks have done his workshops. (myself included) Werner Erhard also worked in this area &#8211; ever do est and its &#8216;Danger Process&#8217; or his 6 Day Course? Both of these seminars included intense group work on body image and simply &#8216;being&#8217; with another.</p>
<p>It all boils down to feeling safe. In birthing, in a relationship, in bed, in a group &#8211; doesn&#8217;t matter what you WANT to get out of the situation, the overiding context is &#8216;do I feel safe enough to let down my guard and explore beyond it?&#8217;   And this is especially true when you get your gear off.</p>
<p>I have no conclusion to offer but appreciate this dialogue. It&#8217;s quiet at the funeral home today and death and sex are very close. But that&#8217;s a whole exploration in its own right.</p>
<p>Vulnerably from rainy Sydney,</p>
<p>Linda</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Francis</title>
		<link>http://www.cosmicconfidential.com/astrology/centaurs-astrology-chiron-nessus.html/comment-page-1#comment-78</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Francis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Feb 2010 23:28:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cosmicconfidential.com/astrology/?p=484#comment-78</guid>
		<description>Linda, you were fortunate to have come of age in a time when there were positive messages about sex, ready birth control, and no deadly sexual diseases. Few people under the age of 40 today have that benefit. Yet what was lacking in the 1960s was a sense of responsibility; a relational ethos; any conscious mode of integrating sexuality into one&#039;s spiritual journey or growth process. There was &quot;free love&quot; but it wasn&#039;t really free; a lot of people paid an emotional price and the perhaps more damaging cost of having their ideals blown up.

I think it&#039;s useful to give people permission not to explore, to a point. Yet sex does more than you are saying; you are describing a viewpoint of sex that doesn&#039;t contain a spiritual element, so far as I am reading you; the relational element you describe is rudimentary; there&#039;s no Pluto or Chiron in there. No discussion of psychic development, emotional exploration, and the sense of shifting identity that can only come through actual -- and grounded -- experience.

I&#039;m suggesting we tune into precisely these things, and begin associating them with our sexuality instead of just the basically flat concepts of gratification and reproductive consequences. 

There&#039;s a lot more going on in conscious sex than that. And there is one other level worth addressing. The tone of the sexual conversation of a society seems to set the tone for many other discussions; a culture that is tolerant and accepting of sexual diversity and experience is more open to other kinds of creative and loving experience. This is year another reason why people who are sexpositive need to offer their affirmative support and space-holding for an authentic conversation and make room for Eros in our world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Linda, you were fortunate to have come of age in a time when there were positive messages about sex, ready birth control, and no deadly sexual diseases. Few people under the age of 40 today have that benefit. Yet what was lacking in the 1960s was a sense of responsibility; a relational ethos; any conscious mode of integrating sexuality into one&#8217;s spiritual journey or growth process. There was &#8220;free love&#8221; but it wasn&#8217;t really free; a lot of people paid an emotional price and the perhaps more damaging cost of having their ideals blown up.</p>
<p>I think it&#8217;s useful to give people permission not to explore, to a point. Yet sex does more than you are saying; you are describing a viewpoint of sex that doesn&#8217;t contain a spiritual element, so far as I am reading you; the relational element you describe is rudimentary; there&#8217;s no Pluto or Chiron in there. No discussion of psychic development, emotional exploration, and the sense of shifting identity that can only come through actual &#8212; and grounded &#8212; experience.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m suggesting we tune into precisely these things, and begin associating them with our sexuality instead of just the basically flat concepts of gratification and reproductive consequences. </p>
<p>There&#8217;s a lot more going on in conscious sex than that. And there is one other level worth addressing. The tone of the sexual conversation of a society seems to set the tone for many other discussions; a culture that is tolerant and accepting of sexual diversity and experience is more open to other kinds of creative and loving experience. This is year another reason why people who are sexpositive need to offer their affirmative support and space-holding for an authentic conversation and make room for Eros in our world.</p>
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		<title>By: LindaGM</title>
		<link>http://www.cosmicconfidential.com/astrology/centaurs-astrology-chiron-nessus.html/comment-page-1#comment-77</link>
		<dc:creator>LindaGM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 20:46:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cosmicconfidential.com/astrology/?p=484#comment-77</guid>
		<description>And now a word from another outlook......

I was a teenager in the 60s and over the years, have shared pleasure with over 100 partners (in every possible combination) but at the wise young age of 56, I am here to say out loud to whoever might secretly feel this too......

What is the big deal about sex? 

Yes, it&#039;s pleasurable - as many things in this world are. Yes, it&#039;s a special intimate activity to share with another - if you are sure you want to share their biological profile and karma. Yes, it can drive you crazy if you don&#039;t get any - but there are many things you can do to relieve the itch (unlike needing air, food and water). Yes, it can take you to transcendent spaces - and so can other genuine spiritual practices. Oh - and making love in certain circumstances can make  babies. Which is commitment that will take 20 or so years to complete, if ever.

I appreciate there are those of us who haven&#039;t explored sexuality to the fullest and may need encouragement but the other side of this needs voicing.

If you aren&#039;t all that interested, that too is fine. We all have our own rhythms and appetites.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And now a word from another outlook&#8230;&#8230;</p>
<p>I was a teenager in the 60s and over the years, have shared pleasure with over 100 partners (in every possible combination) but at the wise young age of 56, I am here to say out loud to whoever might secretly feel this too&#8230;&#8230;</p>
<p>What is the big deal about sex? </p>
<p>Yes, it&#8217;s pleasurable &#8211; as many things in this world are. Yes, it&#8217;s a special intimate activity to share with another &#8211; if you are sure you want to share their biological profile and karma. Yes, it can drive you crazy if you don&#8217;t get any &#8211; but there are many things you can do to relieve the itch (unlike needing air, food and water). Yes, it can take you to transcendent spaces &#8211; and so can other genuine spiritual practices. Oh &#8211; and making love in certain circumstances can make  babies. Which is commitment that will take 20 or so years to complete, if ever.</p>
<p>I appreciate there are those of us who haven&#8217;t explored sexuality to the fullest and may need encouragement but the other side of this needs voicing.</p>
<p>If you aren&#8217;t all that interested, that too is fine. We all have our own rhythms and appetites.</p>
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